I HATE D@MNED COTTER RINGS!!!!!!!!!

What kind of rings are you using? Get some with an "open" design they are a lot easier to install.
http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?productId=99449&catalogId=10001

the ones they sell at west marine have one of the ends bent inwards, this helps a ton when removing them.

Ha! Great minds think alike.

how about this? they may be available at your local hardware store also.

http://www.murrays.com/mm5/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=MS&Product_Code=25-220&Category_Code=

also called "hairclip pin". you could push it past the first little V to the bigger round part to make sure it stays in place.

almax00 wrote: how about this? they may be available at your local hardware store also.

also called "hairclip pin". you could push it past the first little V to the bigger round part to make sure it stays in place.

The only place I've used that style clip is on the rudder pins. Not something I'd use on a clevis pin. Even the open style rings I showed above are a slight hazard since they could snag the open bit. Anywhere there are rings that don't need to be removed regularly I use the completely closed style

I use the open style rings (ring-dings?) and use electrical tape around them on the shrouds.

On a low wind day last summer, the wind totally died at one point and I jumped in to cool off. When climbing back up I noticed that the chainplate staring me in the face had the ring totally missing, and the clevis pin was only through one of the holes in the chainplate. Any wind at all and I would have dismasted.

I agree, it's a bad idea to use anything other than ringdings taped in place on standing rigging. The open ring dings are much easier to take on and off though. I use quick pins on everything else that I need to take off and put on the boat frequently (boom gooseneck, sail outhaul, mainsheet above and below, jib clew, jib blocks, hiking stick and rudder cross bar). And I keep a container of extra pins and rings on the boat in case something falls out.

Hair clip pins are even a bad idea on the rudder pins. They can get caught in the casting (leaving you unable to budge the rudder) and I have had one catch in the casting and drop the pin in the lake, that made for a VERY bad day. I only use bend back type cotter pins on the rudder pins now.

Regards,
Dave

My MacGregor 36 cat had stainless bolts with stainless nuts that had the nylock inserts to hold the standing rigging.

On my H18, I struggled with needing three hands to attach the forestay to the bridle. Now I have that connection with a pin and closed ring, since it stays attached all the time. On each end of the bridle, I use a quick pin. But.. I snug the quick pin in down and in place with a small cable tie that gets clipped off and expended when de-rigging at the end of the day. The side stays stay attached with pins and closed-type rings, covered by a shroud adjuster cover.

yurdle wrote: I use the open style rings (ring-dings?) and use electrical tape around them on the shrouds.

On a low wind day last summer, the wind totally died at one point and I jumped in to cool off. When climbing back up I noticed that the chainplate staring me in the face had the ring totally missing, and the clevis pin was only through one of the holes in the chainplate. Any wind at all and I would have dismasted.

Yurdle,

I've been there too...on a leaner....at a sail club I used to belong to. Starbord side pin just disappeared somewhere along the way.(??) Returned to the marina (port tac only) and the club maintenance guys acted like it happened more than rarely....reapplied with tape as suggested here and we were back in business....crazy how that happens.

does anyone have a trick for opening them up and installing/removing them besides tearing one's fingernails/nail beds up in the process?

I hear you, fingernails that work fine at the start of the day get water softened & useless. Easy solution, make a small tool for your tramp bag. I have an aluminum "shackle dog" on a key float that stays in the zippered pouch on the tramp. I filed the dogs nose thin, like a fine screwdriver. Only file a millitmeter or two thin. Push the fine edge inbetween the 2 wires of the ring ding, right where one of the wires ends. The short thin section makes it easy to slide into the ringding, the thicker part seperates the wires a millileter or two.
It is now very easy to get the wire started into whatever you are trying to secure. You can even do it with one hand, holding the ring ding on your "tool" between thumb & forefinger.
No more finger pain!

Wolfman wrote:

Hair clip pins are even a bad idea on the rudder pins. They can get caught in the casting (leaving you unable to budge the rudder) and I have had one catch in the casting and drop the pin in the lake, that made for a VERY bad day. I only use bend back type cotter pins on the rudder pins now.

Regards,
Dave

heh, i had an experience with a bobbypin style clip on my rudder pin break and lucky for me... when the rudders are locked in, the pin doesn't drop to the sea floor. Still took me a while to figure it out. Only thing i had on the boat was a small rusty keyring that went to my trailer lock or something.

I keep one of these in my pocket or lashed to me at all times!! http://www.myerchin.com/P300_Sailors_Tool.html if you have a tough ring ding you can use the knife or marlinspike to open them and hold them open while installing. It lets you tighten shackes, undo cotter pins, cut line. When you trapped under your boat you can cut yourself free. At then end of the day you can open your beers with it. And it won't break or bend, ever. By far the best and most useful sailing tool I own and I have a few.

My MacGregor 36 cat had stainless bolts with stainless nuts that had the nylock inserts to hold the standing rigging.

Wow, that's something I never thought of. It seems like it would work great for those of us that leave the stick up all season...I'd probably find a good reason to need to dismast the thing the first time out after using nylocs.

Wolfman wrote: I keep one of these in my pocket or lashed to me at all times!! http://www.myerchin.com/P300_Sailors_Tool.html if you have a tough ring ding you can use the knife or marlinspike to open them and hold them open while installing. It lets you tighten shackes, undo cotter pins, cut line. When you trapped under your boat you can cut yourself free. At then end of the day you can open your beers with it. And it won't break or bend, ever. By far the best and most useful sailing tool I own and I have a few.

I carry the P300, too, and never thought of using it on a ring-ding. However, I'm not sure about the rest of what you wrote. Last time I tried to open my P300, it had recently spent some time in salt water without a good rinse, and it took me over a minute to open it while sitting in my TV chair. I'm not counting on it or anything else to get my out of 'stuck'. AND, more importantly, why a knife to open your beers? Surely you adhere to the utmost lake safety practices of cans or plastic cups.

I live about as far away from salt water as you can get, so I don't have the experience. I imagine that would screw up any folding knife. I do know my P300 hasn't let me down yet. I just wish it came with a non-serrated blade, because it makes a mess of high tech line when cutting it to length (use a ceramic for that). But I'm pretty sure I could amputate a limb (someone elses) with it if I needed to. And I've bent quite a few 'hobie keys' and other odd 'sailing tools' that weren't worth the steel (or plastic) they were stamped from.

Naw, Coronas with lime wedges on the beach at all times. Need a bottle opener... like a MAN! I don't drink and sail (or at least I don't drink while I'm sailing). 😉

Edited by Wolfman on Jul 12, 2011 - 10:13 PM.

Salt water was a new thing to me, too. Apparently, 'stainless' is a relative term. Agree w/ the rest re: the knife and blade.

Beers with fruit, however, hard necessitate an all caps 'man'.

more importantly, why a knife to open your beers?

Dave lives in the middle of the continent(nowhere:-D)
Twist off tops haven't filtered that far inland yet. (Grolsch also comes in 500ml cans with pull tabs that can be actioned with one hand, you should always have one hand on the tiller after all.

I can't remember even one day sailing without having to endure a day or two of postsailing pain from finger damage associated with D@MNED COTTER RINGS!!

Maybe you should get a jet ski.

Edited by golfdad75 on Jul 13, 2011 - 07:49 AM.

I agree with EC, I do live pretty much nowhere. As we say here, at least it isn't Regina!

And citrus fruit is good for you! You don't want to get scurvy like the sailors of old! Maybe the all caps was a little much though.

Ideally there should only be a couple to deal with. I leave everything connected and tapped but 2. I loosen one stay when when taking the mast down. So when I put it up I only have to pin the forestay then retention and re-pin the shroud. I do have big one on my mast hinge pin but it is not to hard. Mostly I keep some small needle nose (I have no finger nails long enough to matter) in a small cooler on the tramp and use it to manage ring dings if I need. I do have a few of the open ones like listed above and that definitely helps.

take a look at a pair of "split ring pliers" usually found at a well stocked fishing tackle outlet....seems a pair would be very useful around a sail boat and I seem to recall the cost at less than $5.

Trumped by the scurvy card. Fair enough.

It's always funny to me when a post produces a lot of responses except the original poster (OP) is never heard from. At least the thread remained sort of on-topic. 😉

Salt water was a new thing to me, too. Apparently, 'stainless' is a relative term. Agree w/ the rest re: the knife and blade.

There are in fact grades of stainless. 304 & 316 are most commonly used in salt water resistant tools. My P300 does not say what grade it is to my memory. One thing I learned working on an excursion boat in salt water is that a good flush with clear water followed by blowing out with compressed air helps. On tools that have closed in areas, (like the hinge on a knife), I follow with a liberal flush with WD40. It is far from my favorite lubricant, but water displacement is it's best trick. Only problem is, once you use it, you have to reapply frequently. Used regularly, the blade will deploy one handed every time. I also agree about the blade, it does make a really ragged cut.

Hard to respond when I can't stop laughing. The open rings look like the way to go. I didn't know those were available. Wish I could have had the patent for that. I need to think of other stimulating topics like this to post purely for everyone's entertainment, including mine.