Suggestion for a beginner

The Escape 18 would be my recommendation. Uses a 16 mast, has wings, and tacks well enough. Plenty of floatation for a crowd. You can also solo it. We have one at my club.
The 19 is a big boy boat. Both the Mystere and 19 are great machines. You won't outgrow the Mystere.
None can reef to my knowledge. You can depower a cat with a jib furler and hanking down on the cunningham. Get familiar with flipping. It is a rite of passage.

I have been advised to stay away from 19 by others too 🙂

I have a mystere for around 2k and I like the look of it.

I am also looking at a Escape Playcat from 2005. What do you think of those? It comes with something that looks like a back support rather than wing seat.

I do like the Escape 18. Playcat Escape is different it seems and looks like rotomolded.

Rotomolded plastic are tough, but slower. Prindles and Mystere are fiberglass and repairable; not the same with the rotomolded plastics, USUALLY. Escape Playcat won't have near the performance and you'll outgrow it, as opposed to the Prindle Escape. Generally, there appear to be enough Prindle spare parts floating around also and lots of people that have set them up. The exception to the above would be a Hobie Getaway, but much more expensive for a decent one and still not as performance boat as the others.

None can reef to my knowledge.

sure they can. All cats that sail in the Everglades Challenge are required to reef (or at least used to be required)
My mystere 6.0 had a reefing system added.

it really is not complex: add reefing grommets fore and aft (new tack for downhaul / new clew for boom and main blocks to hang off) , add a way to secure the rolled up part of the sail (i had a simple loops of webbing added to the sail on each side and simply ran a bit of line from one loop on one side to the other) there is no force applied to this rolled up part of the sail, you could use dental floss if you wanted to

take the mainsail off the hook and add a way to secure the halyard on the lower part of the mast: a simple cleat will do, I had a spin lock riveted in the bottom of my mast track) - viola !! you have a reefing system for as cheap as a few grommets and a cleat.

that being said, unless you are planning on going on a long distance race in hurricane season, or want to sail in 25+ knots ... it was not needed. I did sail in 25+ knots for fun and it was pretty amazing being out in that weather with out white knuckling it, but rigging, launching, anchoring and current were horrific to deal with .... not to mention dropping the mast afterwords

Reefed:

reefing loops and aft grommet for the new clew

foreward grommet for new tack

you can't see it but on the forward grommet on the other side of the sail, where that webbing strope is there is also a mast slug so the bolt rope can't pull out of the mast track

Edited by MN3 on May 15, 2023 - 10:34 PM.

I have a mystere 5.5, a prindle 18, a prindle 19, a prindle escape 18 near me on the market place for around 2-3k. I am liking the idea of Mystere apart from cool name, because of center boards, thinking it might tack better - lay guess, not a fact. I like the look of prindle 19 but might be too much for me. Can any of them be sailed with reefed sail so that I can keep training wheels so to speak?

Prindle 19 is a good but a lot of boat - if you have experience it is fine - it is based off the Tornado design. If it is a P19MX, this is not for a newb
prindle 18 is a great boat, older design, less deck room for 3 adults would be a bit challenging unless small adults
prindle 18 escape is ... not so great imho - and will be hard to service, rotomolded hulls are heavy and slow - https://www.thebeachcats.com/forums/viewtopic/topic/12850 - ymmv

Mystere 5.5 is the bomb. I owned 3 mysteres in the past. Yes the centerboards will assist with tacking, and can be retracted in shallow water and when beaching/launching. also - it is also based off the Tornado design, was actually a trainer boat for olympic sailors at one time. It is very easy to depower it - Lots of downhaul, lots of outhaul and you have depowered it some. furl the jib and you have depowerd it allot but lose some tacking control. OR you can just buy a used f18 sail (cheap) and it will have much less HorsePower than a stock sail. i had 3 of them through the years. i put them on in heavy air (I sailed solo 99% of the time). It is a very fast and responsive boat when sailed well (as is the P19)

where are you located?

Thanks Charlescarlis and MN3. Also, MN3, thanks for the detailed pics. I am in the Daytona Beach area. I will try to get the Mystere. Sounds like a great boat. I think the seller said no tramp. There is one on the boat in the pics but he said it needs one. I will contact the seller and see as I don't know if he meant it comes without one or it is in need of replacing.

Also, I don't know how easy they are to disassemble. Don't have a truck to haul the trailer at present and trying to get a rental truck that allows towing is a pain!!

the boats come apart with 8 bolts, 2 on each side of each beam (front and back) a new one will need to be ordered. all you need is a spanner wrench or a 9/16 rachet

you don't need a truck to haul a beach cat, any car with a tow hitch can do it (even a mini but not the best option). I have pulled cats with honda accords, lexus es and a honda crv. You can get a hitch attached at most U-haul locations for a few hundred bucks or put it on a car yourself with a hitch from etrailer.com

I agree most any car can tow a cat as long as the trailer isn't really heavy.

Is this the Mystere that you are looking at 😀

https://www.thebeachcats.com/classifieds/catamarans-for-sale/p17773-1995-mystere-5-5dunedin-fl.html

Edited by gdog on May 16, 2023 - 09:10 AM.

My car is a Mazda 6 and some genius at the Mazda decided the towing capacity is zero!! I found the enterprise truck rental or homedepot flat bed trucks. I don't mind hauling it on one of those. Enterprise guys allow towing on trucks with more than 3/4 ton. Homedepot ones can take it dismantled. I will also look at adding a tow hitch to my Mazda. I saw that they can tow 1500lb in Europe. So, I don't see why they forget the ability while swimming across the pond!!

Also, what do you mean by "new ones need to be ordered". Are you talking about the bolts? If so, will they need to be ordered from Mystere or any ordinary hardware store?

Sorry to bombard you with questions.
Thanks

Thanks Charlescarlis and MN3. Also, MN3, thanks for the detailed pics. I am in the Daytona Beach

Check your private messages

Also, what do you mean by "new ones need to be ordered". Are you talking about the bolts? If so, will they need to be ordered from Mystere or any ordinary hardware store?

that was a typo, i meant the tramp is shot and a new one will need to be ordered
bolts are fine and even if you needed one for some reason (you lost one somehow), they are available at ace hardware

MN3....I think he is talking about buying your Mystere.

saltlife77 wrote: MN3....I think he is talking about buying your Mystere.

yes, we are gonna talk later today

gdog wrote: I agree most any car can tow a cat as long as the trailer isn't really heavy.

Is this the Mystere that you are looking at 😀

https://www.thebeachcats.com/classifieds/catamarans-for-sale/p17773-1995-mystere-5-5dunedin-fl.html Edited by gdog on May 16, 2023 - 09:10 AM.

Hi gdog

Yes

Tarch...I am in Deland. There is a great group of Cat Sailors in the Daytona Area. Hobie Fleet 80 and Halifax Sailing Assoc are whom I sail with. Send me a PM when you get a boat. Good Luck.

saltlife77 wrote: Tarch...I am in Deland. There is a great group of Cat Sailors in the Daytona Area. Hobie Fleet 80 and Halifax Sailing Assoc are whom I sail with. Send me a PM when you get a boat. Good Luck.

I sent you a PM 🙂

I have a Kia Forte with a manual transmission and can tow my boat. (Boat and trailer combined is about 600 lbs.)

Even a Prius can tow a (18') cat. I've seen it done.

I'm sure your Mazda 6 will be just fine.

Hi Danielt1263 and MN3,

I am sure the Mazda can tow it. I doubt the whole trailer and boat weigh that much. Don't know about concerns with insurance being void if I do hit someone since Mazda says no towing allowed!! I know that most likely I am overthinking it.

On a separate note, that Mini pulling the cat is hilarious. Can't imagine the looks you get on the road 🙂

I doubt the whole trailer and boat weigh that muc

750 lbs would be my guess. 400 ish for boat 350 for trailer.

tarch wrote:
I am sure the Mazda can tow it. I doubt the whole trailer and boat weigh that much. Don't know about concerns with insurance being void if I do hit someone since Mazda says no towing allowed!! I know that most likely I am overthinking it.

I don't see where insurance would care but you could always call them. If your car is still under warranty, that would probably be voided.

danielt1263 wrote: [quote=tarch]
I am sure the Mazda can tow it. I doubt the whole trailer and boat weigh that much. Don't know about concerns with insurance being void if I do hit someone since Mazda says no towing allowed!! I know that most likely I am overthinking it.

I don't see where insurance would care but you could always call them. If your car is still under warranty, that would probably be voided.

I am pretty sure the warranty period is over. It is 5 yr old car. That is a good point

tarch wrote: Morning all

I have been sailing a monohull for a year or so. Looking to get a cat 🙂

I am looking to get one that is ok for 3 adults at least, not too frightening for someone new and reasonable enough to not outgrow too soon. I know it is hard to give advise without knowing my skills.

I have a mystere 5.5, a prindle 18, a prindle 19, a prindle escape 18 near me on the market place for around 2-3k.

I am liking the idea of Mystere apart from cool name, because of center boards, thinking it might tack better - lay guess, not a fact.

I like the look of prindle 19 but might be too much for me. Can any of them be sailed with reefed sail so that I can keep training wheels so to speak?

Any suggestions or guidance gladly taken.

Thanks

With starting out, I would agree with the 18 Escape; mainly because of the smaller sail plan. I started catamarans on a Nacra 5.8 and Tornado.. But, I had been racing with my family for a good decade previously. The P18 is also a good boat for starting out and one that you can run for quite a while. I currently race against a very competitive P18 and he has no problem tacking. With all cats, it's all in the technique (ease about an armlengh of mainsheet during the tack). The 19 is a nice boat, but the bows are not forgiving when they bury. I had a 19 from 1990 to 2008 and currently have a modified 18-2. In breeze over 18, you need to stay on your toes with the flat decks. The P18 has more forgiveness with the more rounded decks as with the Mystere. The dagger boards are nice on the Mystere, but you will have constant maintenance with the centerboard trunks. On my Nacra 5.8 and 6.0, it was a constant battle with leaks. They sail much better to windward, but it has a tradeoff. Obviously, the P18 and Escape will not sail to windward as well as a boarded boat, but in 3-8 knots of wind, the P18 is hard to shake off. Sailing on/off the beach without boards is very nice. I think the biggest challenge you will have with the Prindles is the rudder system. I got rid of the locking system in 1991 and built a line pull down system. Typically, the horizontal bolt to lock into gets bent. It is not a hard fix, 1/4" hex bolt, and I recommend replacing this bolt before you even go sailing. These rudders will frustrate the hell out of ya.

The [del]dagger[/del] centerboards boards are nice on the Mystere, but you will have constant maintenance with the centerboard trunks.

Fixed if for ya

Most Mystere's have centerboards, not daggers (except for the f18 "twister" and the smallern mystere's are skeg) and they do not require constant maintenance. the only time i had an issue was when i unknowingly dropped a large shackle down one and did some damage when i put the board down. so 1 time in 15 years isn't so bad.

tarch.... https://orlando.craigslist.org/boa/d/orlando-nacra-52-sailboat/7624251513.html
Not sure how you go wrong for $600 on a trailer.

Not sure how you go wrong for $600 on a trailer.

non furling, possibly blown out dacron sails, dagger boards, probably non registered/titled boat

If those aren't issues, worth looking out - check for soft hulls

non furling, possibly blown out dacron sails, dagger boards, probably non registered/titled boat

If those aren't issues, worth looking out - check for soft hulls

MN3...Trailer has current registration and is worth $4-500 alone...I believe this thread started out as he is a beginner.

sounds like a non titled boat. IF that is important to you, it is a kinda big deal.

If the boat and the sails are decent, and you don't mind dagger boards ... this is a cheap price for a used 5.2

Thanks texastuma. I don't have as much experience as you did when you bought yours.

Saltlife77 and MN3, that does look cheap for a 5.2.

Are they forgiving in terms of front end flotation should the bows go under water?

How big an issue is it if the boat is not registered? I plan to run it in the intercostals. If it has the manufacturer certificate of origin or something like that, will that allow me to register with a bill of sale?

Thanks