Best way to start catamaran sailing and teach my kids

i think ... Yes! GO FOR IT!
H16 is a great way to start, 18 isn't much harder to learn, and will give you more room for crew and gear - but weight is an issue for many solo sailors (pushing an 18 around the beach or solo stepping the mast)
both issues can be overcome with beachwheels, gin pole and experience

I would suggest you find a fleet and go crew for a few rides
make sure it's you cup of tea and then jump in

You can't go wrong with either boat. I have owned them both and still own a 16. The 16 is easier to beach launch due to lighter weight. I consider it easier to rig because of the shorter mast. Also, the 16 does not have dagger boards which is one less thing to worry about. The 16 doesn't really like more than 2 medium adults and a picnic, but an additional child isn't a deal breaker. More than that you should consider the 18 for weight capacity and it really is the better sailing boat, especially when the wind picks up. I found mine to be a beast wrestling on and off the beach. The standard roller furling is nice and if you are lucky enough to have wings you'll be loving life. I am in the Florida Panhandle, if you make it this far east I'm happy to take you for a test drive on a 16

Edited by jalex on Aug 27, 2018 - 04:17 PM.

So Jalex - are you reccommending the 18 with wings?

most people love the idea of wings - i did too -
mine currently hang in my garage - i stopped using them

they are wonderful with wind but:
add to rigging and tear down time

and more importantly to me - they add weight - in the wrong spot
more towards the mid/aft part of the boat (not desirable)
this make light wind tacking more difficult

and crew always want to be up on the wings - this is not good in light air conditions

So Jalex - are you reccommending the 18 with wings?

Depends on your definition of family. A wife and small child? The 16. More than that, the 18. But really I think since you are new to cats get a 16, you can usually sell it for what you paid if you want to move up.

Thanks guys - I do appreciate the suggestions and input.

May I suggest a prindle? I've sailed a Hobie 14,16 and 18 but I like my prindle the best for handling, hull buoyancy (lower risk of pitch pole). I currently sail a prindle 15,but the 16 has more room for crew. Parts could be an issue, but many parts from other boats can work on the prindle too. Just my 2 cents. Good luck.

prindle and hobie 16 and 18's are very very similar boats
small differences, but over-all not much difference between them

other good legacy cats to consider are

dart 18's (light and easy to rig / great high wind boats)
supercat 17 great boat with lots of manufacturer support (rare in legacy boats) but heavy boat and crazy heavy mast
nacra 5.7 - skeg boat (no boards) no boom
g-cat 5.0 / 5.7 - great boat / front tramp - limited support / few parts but beams and masts are very similar to hobie mast extrusions

IF you have the cash ...
a new mystere 5.5 or nacra 500 or 570 would be my choice
why? 20-30 year old legacy boats have wear and rust that can cause catastrophic failure at almost any time
esp if sailed in salt water

I was thinking a NACRA 570 all along - will that not be too much to sail with kiddos? Can you dump the power fairly easily?

dgoodwyn wrote: I was thinking a NACRA 570 all along - will that not be too much to sail with kiddos? Can you dump the power fairly easily?

downhaul (cunningham), outhaul and traveler can all be used to reduce power
to really put it into granny-gear you can furl the jib and dramatically reduce healing motion and power

also - many of us have high wind sails for days we want to sail and keep it sane -you could get an old sail and cut it down pretty cheaply for days with kids on board too

last option is to set it up for reefing - i have a reefable main on my 6.0 (this boat was refabricated for a family of 3 with a 7 year old at the time)

https://www.ebay.com/itm/G-Cat-Racing-Catamaran-Sail-Boat-With-Trailer/332771738407?hash=item4d7abdc327:g:xEQAAOSw-ABbeisR
No affiliation, just one to consider.
The G-Cat has a front tramp

I do like my Gcat, Very simple rig but can perform decent when you want it to. Harder and harder to find them in decent shape. I do worry about the rudders, they are bound to break and hard to find replacements. Most of the other parts can retrofitted from other boats

I do worry about the rudders, they are bound to break and hard to find replacements

Call Andrew @ the tackle shack in pinellas park. He has a warehouse full of old cat parts.

Call Andrew @ the tackle shack in pinellas park. He has a warehouse full of old cat parts.

Good info, I already bought one parts boat, and was thinking of buying a second. Be nice to buy the parts and not the boat

dgoodwyn wrote: I've sailed monohulls my whole life. All shapes and sizes. I want to get into cat sailing mainly so I can:

1: Have a beach launchable boat that will hold more that just me and
2: To teach my kids how to sail and take the family sailing and
3: A boat that I can easily trailer to mexico and as I stated earlier - beach launch up and down the Gulf coast.

Oh - and I live in Lafayette, LA. Right now I'm leaning towards a Hobie 16 or 18.

What do ya'll think?

Nacra 570 or 5.7 is a great choice, if I was on the market again I'd choose that one, simple, fast, lot of room on the tramp, you can bring the family (say or 3 adults or 2adults +2kids).
No boom = safe and simple
No daggerboard= simple + all seats available for the crew.
If I'm not wrong, the 570 has the jib block on the front beam, which means free tramp, without the 4-way system in between

Beachwheels make your life much easier, consider them, they are often part of the deal.

I missed speed among your reasons, if it's not really on the list, your 3 points above don't necessarily translate into a beachcat. If you like planing and playing the waves on monohulls, you might miss that. Unless you like speed...
Stepping the mast and launching is not necessarily easier on an 18 ft cat, which is what you need if you want more than 2 on board.

Another option, more family oriented, less performant but more stable, buoyant, takes more people, very easy to rig: the Hobie Getaway.

How much do you weight and what would be your typical and occasional crew?

@ Andinista:

Thank you for your thorough response. I do like speed - it is fun. My crew will be my wife and 2 kids (ages 3 and 6). I grew up sailing at that age and that set me up with a life long passion. My issue with a monohul is that outside of a sunfish or laser I don't know of any that I can beach launch.. where as the cats seem to be designed to do that with trailer additions like the beach trax that just make it easy. I find a sunfish or laser too small to effectively teach on.. I don't think a 420 or 470 as beach launchable.. am I wrong?

The only issue I have with the SKEG hull would be it's ability to point into the wind.. I know that is an issue with cats in general and I feel that a SKEG will only amplifiy that issue - am I correct here?

I love to plain and play the waves on monohulls.. but I'm willing to forgo that for a boat that I can launch anywhere.. form a beach or a campsite on a lake. Where I live in S. Louisiana there are almost no sailboat friendly launches and when we do go to the beach in the Florida Panhandle or on an annual trip to San Carlos mexico, a beach launchable option is all that I'll have.

David

The only issue I have with the SKEG hull would be it's ability to point into the wind.. I know that is an issue with cats in general and I feel that a SKEG will only amplifiy that issue - am I correct here?

not really an issue - you are talking a deg or 2 and unless you are racing against other classes - who cares and even if you are open class racing - the handicap systems take this into effect

IMHO
technique and weight placement will have an equal to greater effect

I would forgo my centerboard for a skeg in a heartbeat

I am not a Nacra guy but my guess is theskegs point better than a Hobie 16, which doesn't really point well without knowing the tricks, but all part of it. Riding in to the beach on surf trying to wrestle the boards up will make you want to give up a few degrees of windward. Not trying to be overly dramatic, but its an important point

Edited by jalex on Aug 29, 2018 - 02:48 PM.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kT2KROiSXDg this

dgoodwyn wrote: @ Andinista:

Thank you for your thorough response. I do like speed - it is fun. My crew will be my wife and 2 kids (ages 3 and 6). I grew up sailing at that age and that set me up with a life long passion. My issue with a monohul is that outside of a sunfish or laser I don't know of any that I can beach launch.. where as the cats seem to be designed to do that with trailer additions like the beach trax that just make it easy. I find a sunfish or laser too small to effectively teach on.. I don't think a 420 or 470 as beach launchable.. am I wrong?

The only issue I have with the SKEG hull would be it's ability to point into the wind.. I know that is an issue with cats in general and I feel that a SKEG will only amplifiy that issue - am I correct here?

I love to plain and play the waves on monohulls.. but I'm willing to forgo that for a boat that I can launch anywhere.. form a beach or a campsite on a lake. Where I live in S. Louisiana there are almost no sailboat friendly launches and when we do go to the beach in the Florida Panhandle or on an annual trip to San Carlos mexico, a beach launchable option is all that I'll have.

David

420 and 470 can have a dolly and trailer that make them more beach launchable than a 16 or 18 ft catamaran in my opinion. But they are probably still a bit small for the family and maybe not stable enough for two kids the age or yours. A catamaran is more stable in light to moderate wind, just make sure to know how to avoid pitchpole.

I googled a bit and found the Laser Bahia, that's the kind of monohull I had in mind, bigger than 470 but more family oriented. It's not clear to me that they are less beach launchable than a cat. Compare weights, find out if somebody makes a dolly and you should be fine. Compared to a cat, it´s probably easier to rig, bearing in mind that catamaran masts are longer.

That said, I'm sure you would love to sail on N500 or N570. Just don't push the limits with the kids on board and enjoy singlehanding at warp speed... If you will be sailing with all the family most of the time, probably a Hobie Getaway is a safer bet.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=QwEnyFT5BDg

Guess everyone's opinion of beach launch is different. Mine includes waves....Catamaran is best choice!!

saltlife77 wrote: Guess everyone's opinion of beach launch is different. Mine includes waves....Catamaran is best choice!!

True. Maybe not for 3 years old kid though.
If wind drops it becomes less manageable, make sure to consider that scenario. (I learned the hard way...)

I've had both the H16 and H18. For what you describe, I think the H16 would fit your needs and be way easier to rig and move around than the H18.

Just one thing on the age of the kids.... I belong to a yacht club where I pay monthly dues to use the boats. I took my 3 and 5 year old grandkids and their parents out on a Catalina 27. The 3 year old was over it about 100 feet from the slip, and the 5 year old was ready to go home 15 minutes later, just as I cleared the break wall. We did encounter a sea lion ripping up a big fish for lunch, so that garnered some interest. Otherwise, I cut the sail short as they just were not into it at all. I loved boats as a kid. Today, there's a lot of competition with the sensory overload of the electronic toys and gadgets.

Your mileage may vary greatly, and it will be on a faster boat. Just throwing it out there as my experience did not meet my expectations at all.

The stability of a NACRA 5.7 / 570 compared to a Hobie or Prindle 16 should not be overlooked. The 5.7 can handle rougher water and higher winds, and still sail circles around the Hobie. There is no top-deck on a NACRA, so the hulls can be buried at speed and it will not pitchpole. Try that with a Hobie or Prindle, and you will end up upside-down. All three of these boats are considered skegg hulls and the lack of centerboards is great for on and off the beach. The 5.7 is outpointed by most monohulls but it doesn't give up much to the centerboard cats. I sail on the same points as a H18, and the two boats are competitive in performance to the point it mostly comes down to the person running the tiller and sail trim.

Get beach wheels! The newer foam core boats have reinforced skegs, and apparently you can even get replaceable skegg shoes from NACRA, but moving a 5.7/570 on the beach is not fun without the wheels. There is no lip on top of the hulls to grab and lift, and you don't really want to pull this thing around by the dolphin striker.

Thank you Tom!

I really like 420's and 470's, sailed them as a teen and launched them off the beach frequently as that was what was available. Centerboard was always an issue but we made do. They are at least 100lbs lighter so that's something. There is just no comparison on what the cat offers as far as space for a 16-18 foot boat. The 8ft beam(or near that) is useable space for almost 50% of the length of the boat, a 470 I think is 5 feet at midships and quickly tapers. Tramps are very relaxing when sailing and also great for lounging when you hit the beach.

True. Maybe not for 3 years old kid though.
If wind drops it becomes less manageable, make sure to consider that scenario. (I learned the hard way...)

Understood...Except I first started sailing/racing Catamaran's with my Dad at 3yrs old. Guess I am Biased!!

No offence to the Hobies (I still own one) but when this discussion starts, few folks want to talk about the 'modern' boats out there today. My F16s weigh 245#s all up. Put that on wheels and you'll be the envy of the beach.