Hey folks, first post on the site here. Seems like some good technical advice bouncing around so I joined up. I just found an old Nacra 5.0 w/o a trailer for cheap on craigslist. I modified an old trailer to fit and drove 3 hours to pick her up. She has been christened The Om, as I foresee many days of dudeness ahead. Thus far I've been scrutinizing the blurry vintage manual on nacrasailing and pausing youtube videos to figure out how this thing is rigged. It was surprisingly complete by the time I got all the parts sorted but I am missing a few things and need some advice. Number one $$ parts missing are the blocks that connect the mainsail clew(?) to the traveler car(?). Please correct my vocab freely. Sooo many new words. Anyway, this seems like a fairly expensive bit of gear. I do have the jib blocks but I'm thinking that on our first sea (lake) trials tomorrow we will start with mainsail only. How should I rig the line to the mainsail w/o the blocks? Can I use the jib blocks on the main temporarily? Also, I am going to get new sheets(?). Research says jib lines should be 5/16 and main lines 3/8? Is that correct? Can I use cheap rope for now and what material is recommended until I can buy higher quality. Lastly, do you have any general advice for our first day. I've sailed a sunfish and a 36' cat. So... let's say I have no beachcat experience at all. I get the uneasy feeling that this thing is gonna take off like a scalded cat so any advice is appreciated.
you need a mainsheet with blocks, there is no way you are going to hold in 1:1. after you get everything else sorted out, get a mast rotator control. i used to sail a 5.o, ask me anything.
the mainsheet blocks are expensive 🙁 but essentiaal, i would not try jib blocks. the boat will perform will with main only, balanced, etc.
you also need the hook that can be changed from hole to hole on the clewplate of the main. the top block of the mainsheet is hooked on and you can change which hole it goes it to alter sail shape while tacking (if careful). you can use a shackle but if you do you loose this feature
it will not be like a scaled cat, it will be a rocket on rails. teh different things about cat sailing are: 1) apparent wind. when you start moving, the wind direction appear to chnage because of your speed. sheet in or bear off. you will be even more surprised downwind, you can tack downwind, jibing between legs, faster than "running" like a monomoran. 2) coming about especiallyu without dagger boards. be patinet, you will get th e hang of it. BTW, do not pinch upwind.
get soft line for the sheets, braided of course, your hands and teeth with thank you. go with recommended thicknesses, thin hurts!
You absolutely need the mainsheet blocks to be able to sheet in and hold the main. Browse the parts classifieds here for used parts, check with Pete Begle(a poster there), he often has mainsheet systems for sale.
Tacking will be easier with the jib than without. For your first few outings, choose light air days. This will give you the opportunity to figure out the boat's handling some before it powers up in stronger breezes. Browse these forums to get a clearer picture of righting procedures and tacking tips. And have fun! Which shouldn't be too hard....
Dave
You absolutely need the mainsheet blocks to be able to sheet in and hold the main. Browse the parts classifieds here for used parts, check with Pete Begle(a poster there), he often has mainsheet systems for sale.
Tacking will be easier with the jib than without. For your first few outings, choose light air days. This will give you the opportunity to figure out the boat's handling some before it powers up in stronger breezes. Browse these forums to get a clearer picture of righting procedures and tacking tips. And have fun! Which shouldn't be too hard....
Dave
Tacking (turning) that boat without jib is not so easy, so starting without it just for simplicity is not necessarily true, I'd go with the jib right away if you manage to set it up. If tacking gets difficult, backwind the jib until you pass the irons and then set it to the other side. It's harder to turn if the crew weight is aft and the boat is sitting on the transoms, with the bows out of the water.. Have the hulls well balanced on the water by moving forward or aft depending on the wind. In light wind you will be closer to the front beam, as it picks up you'll see that you need to move aft, but when tacking you may find the boat sitting on the transoms again, be aware and move your weight as necessary. If it's still difficult to tack, release the main for a moment after it changes side. Also, don't target to adjust the jib at once, give it some sheet at first to allow the boat to accelerate and then pull as needed. The cat produces a lot of apparent wind, so the sail angle for acceleration is different than for cruise speed.
Thanks for all the quick replies. So there is no way to take it out tomorrow w/o the main blocks? That's disappointing. Now to make sure I understand the sheet rigging: for the jib, I have two small harken pulleys attached to the jibsail. I thread the line from the jib block that is attached near the side shroud on the hull, through the pulley on the jib, back to the jib block cleat, across the tramp, through the other jib block cleat, up to the second pulley on the jibsail, back down to the block, and tie it off. How long is that line usually supposed to be, total? What is the threading direction for the main blocks? In the old manuals, the main blocks each had 3 pulleys. Is that called 8:1?
Flyhull, what is a mast rotator control? I haven't seen anything like that on this boat.
mast rotator is not stock but really handy to depower. it is a bar that faces forward from the foot of the mast and can be pulled to one side or the other (and cleated). murray's has the $29 pluss the cleats. you remove the mast bottom fitting and use a longer bolt though it to hold it on. by rotating the mast you control mast bend.
I have both the 5.0 & a 5.7(essentially the same boat, just bigger).
You do not need 8:1 on a 5.0, stock is a 5:1(quite a bit cheaper). On the 5.7 we use a 7:1.
PEte Begle, or Dan Berger,(both have classified here, both are honest), can probably set you up, don't even attempt to sail without it, unless you go out in 2mph wind.
Top of classifieds has a 5.2 being parted, call him, he probably has the main & jib sheet too. Cheap line is a waste of money, better to buy decent used line than spend even $30 on crap & end up replacing it anyway.
Not sure where you are, I'm in Canada & have a main & jib sheet for that boat.
Forget the mast rotator, it is NOT something you need as a noob, hell, most of the longtime sailors don't bother with it on the boomless rigs.
I removed it from my 5.7, as it in not needed most of the time, & if you forget to cut it loose first in big wind, you can lose the mast.
Here is an album with a bunch of my 5.7 photos, it rigs exactly like your 5.0. There is a photo of jib blocks, & reeving of 7:1 main blocks. In this forum,& albums, click on any embedded photos to blow them up to full size.
http://www.thebeachcats.com/pictures?g2_itemId=71715
Did you get BOTH Nacra manuals?
They are dated, but there is lots of good info there.
Harken has some good drawings on reeving, they sort of hide it under "manuals, or "technical", I'll see if I can find the link.
E C Hilliard
Nacra 5.7
Bombardier Invitation
For reeving your blocks, just do a Google search for "Harken Block Reeving" and then look under the images section. There are several good examples of various setups that will get you going.
How about this setup:
Alright now I'm seeing things more clearly. Thanks Edchris177 for the pics. So basically there is a line coming from the main block AND a line coming from the traveler car? Is that right? Which line do you use when on the move?
So to get a 5:1 I would need a double pulley with a becket on one end and a double pulley with a cam on the other?
Here's a link that shows how to rig the main blocks to the traveler. Look at pics #10-13. All beach cats are rigged pretty much the same way in this area.
http://www.cg.cfpsa.ca/cg-pc/Comox/SiteCollectionDocuments/EN/Sailing/hobie_rigging_basics.pdf
om wrote: So to get a 5:1 I would need a double pulley with a becket on one end and a double pulley with a cam on the other?
No, a triple with cleat on the bottom and a double with becket on the top gives you 5:1
Count the blocks to get the ratio. 3+3=6:1
Ron Beliech
Nacra F-18
Brandon, MS
om wrote: Alright now I'm seeing things more clearly. Thanks Edchris177 for the pics. So basically there is a line coming from the main block AND a line coming from the traveler car? Is that right? Which line do you use when on the move?
Yes two lines, but they are one continuous line or the ends tied together. One end works the traveler, and the other the sheet. Think of the sheet as fine adjustment and the traveler as course. Traveler centered up wind and out at the hiking straps downwind.
Ron Beliech
Nacra F-18
Brandon, MS
IIRC the stock,(& what I have on the 5.0) is 2 "doubles", with the bottom one having an extra single, below the double. Whatever you find for a good price.
Yes two lines, but they are one continuous line or the ends tied together.
There should be an eyestrap on the rear beam, center. For the 5.0 just tie a stopper knot at one end of traveller line. Pull free end through pad eye til it stops at padeye. Feed free end through the traveler car & tie off to end of main sheet. (Before you tie it off, run the traveler out to the end of track, & tie another knot in traveler line so that the car cannot quite go to the end under load).
If you don't use this second stopper knot, you risk the car slamming into the end of the track. It WILL shear off that little plastic piece at the end, & the car & all the bearings will go into the drink. You will get the car back, as it's captive on the line, but your bearings will be gone.
When solo & the winds up, I always hang the business end of the traveler line over the hull, just at the rear beam. If you are getting way overpowered it is easy, even from the wire, to do a knee bend, grab the line & let the traveler out.
I have it rigged 3:1 on the 5.7, but this is overkill on the 5.0.
If this is still available, buy the double/single for $30, then source a double with becket.
http://www.thebeachcats.com/classifieds/catamaran-parts-for-sale/p13392-blocks-and-a-harness-plate.html
Call this guy, right now.
http://www.thebeachcats.com/classifieds/catamaran-parts-for-sale/p13960-84-nacra-5-2parting-out.html
Do a search on Ebay, quite a few parts there.
Edited by Edchris177 on Apr 11, 2015 - 08:57 AM.
E C Hilliard
Nacra 5.7
Bombardier Invitation
Like this for the bottom 1/2.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/HARKEN-HEXA-CAT-H170-WITH-H003-ATTACHED-5-1-HEXARATCHET-BLOCK-W-CAM-CLEAT-/191554464848?hash=item2c99892c50&vxp=mtr
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Harken-HAR004-2-25-Double-Block-w-Becket-7-16-line-dia-NOS-Original-Package-/321641189994?pt=Boat_Parts_Accessories_Gear&hash=item4ae34f126a&vxp=mtr
If you can't find something reasonable here, just google;
hobie mainsheet block, or Nacra, there are plenty of 'em for sale, you should be able to get one with decent line.
Like this
http://www.ebay.com/itm/5-1-Harken-Mainsheet-Setup-Hobie-Prindle-Nacra-Catamaran-Sailboat-/151644728330?hash=item234ebaec0a&vxp=mtr
Or this is better, it eliminates the single, giving a shorter system. We sometimes get "block-to-block" with the other system.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Sailboat-5-1-Harken-Mainsheet-Setup-Hobie-Prindle-Nacra-/151388946062?pt=Boat_Parts_Accessories_Gear&hash=item233f7bfe8e&vxp=mtr
Just don't buy one of the cheaper sets that uses several single blocks. Those are for use on a boom, which you don't have, won't work.
Edited by Edchris177 on Apr 10, 2015 - 03:38 PM.
E C Hilliard
Nacra 5.7
Bombardier Invitation
There is a couple of people parting out Nacra 5.2's here on this site ,you should be able to get all the parts you need from them.
Edchris177 wrote:
So to get a 5:1 I would need a double pulley with a becket on one end and a double pulley with a cam on the other?
No, a triple with cleat on the bottom and a double with becket on the top gives you 5:1
Count the blocks to get the ratio. 3+3=6:1Both examples are 5:1 Ron. The mechanical advantage when using pulleys is determined by the number of load bearing lines. If you look at the reeving diagram posted, the dead end to becket gives you the 5th line, same as using a triple & double.If you rig it upside down you only get 4:1.
Ed, if your referring to this diagram from the harken site, that's a triple on the bottom not a double. If I turn it upside down it's still the same 5:1
The original poster asked about two doubles one with a becket and one with a cleat. That will not work as 5:1. How would you get to the cleat on the bottom without a third block on the bottom?
Ron Beliech
Nacra F-18
Brandon, MS
My apologies, thank you for pointing that out, you are absolutely correct. The extra line from the becket obviously needs a block on the bottom to turn around, I had a senior moment.
I'll edit the misinformation out of previous post.
Edited by Edchris177 on Apr 11, 2015 - 08:58 AM.
E C Hilliard
Nacra 5.7
Bombardier Invitation
Looking back up at the diagram of the two blocks, the top block should have a hook not a shackle. This is not essential at all but it allows you go change sail shape on the fly when you tack (slowly). There should be 5 holes in the clew plate on the sail to support this. It does the same thing as an adjustable outhaul (kinda). My prior comment about the mast rotator was based on experiences in wind over 30 knots. On a normal day it is not useful unless racing when you might use it to over rotate your mast going deep downwind
Looking back up at the diagram of the two blocks, the top block should have a hook not a shackle.
Good call.
We leave the sail free in the wind until ready to push off the boat lift. The last item is drop the hook into whichever hole on the clew plate you choose,(further back = more power) sheet in & sail away.
Returning, simply head the boat into the wind, pop the hook out of the clew plate, jump off & walk the boat to where ever you're going, the sail will sit in the null no power position.
Beats the heck out of undoing a shackle.
E C Hilliard
Nacra 5.7
Bombardier Invitation
If you don't use this second stopper knot, you risk the car slamming into the end of the track. It WILL shear off that little plastic piece at the end, & the car & all the bearings will go into the drink.
Make it look like this.
E C Hilliard
Nacra 5.7
Bombardier Invitation
the picture looking down on the traveler is how mine was after i upgraded to a better traveler car. the 1983 model had a 4 roller ronstan traveler car with the cam cleat for the traveler on the traveler car. Concept about knots is the same (though the end stops on the ronstan were beefier) but if the picture does not match it is because you have an earlier model. if you do, you might be able to find the parts to upgrade to teh set-up above with a 6 roller ronstan car which will handle the load better.
also in the picture above tie the tail of the traveler control line in teh bottom right to the tail of the mainsheet and make sure they are different colors. one is fatter than the other so use a sheet bend.