Mast stepping and unstepping

kevinbatchelor wrote: Here is how i raise the mast solo. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=733z8c7EUJ8 Edited by kevinbatchelor on Jul 09, 2014 - 01:45 PM.

If you were to tie the jib sheet to the mast at about chest height, would that eliminate that touchy step of reaching down to grab the sheet?

goodsailing wrote: I don't see how anyone can pin the bridle without mechanical tension.

You need to loosen the rig before you step the mast (actually before you lower the mast from the previous outing) so there is negligible tension on the forestay. Once the mast is up, tighten the shroud(s). You can either have someone hang off the trap wires while you adjust the shroud or you can hoist the boom up with the main halyard, pull it over to one side, and then hold the mast up using the mainsheet blocks while you adjust the shroud solo.

sm

or you can hoist the boom up with the main halyard, pull it over to one side, and then hold the mast up using the mainsheet blocks while you adjust the shroud solo.

you can also do this with the main sail fully hoisted and attached to the mast and boom - just make sure you are pointed into the wind and be ready to pop the main/travler incase of a strong wind shift (i bet having crew is sounding better and better 😎 )

Edited by MN3 on May 18, 2015 - 05:48 PM.

[quote=MN3]

you can also do this with the main sail fully hoisted and attached to the mast and boom - just make sure you are pointed into the wind and be ready to pop the main/travler incase of a strong wind shift

Yes, I have seen people adjust their rig like this. No, it is not a good idea.

If you pop the main/traveler because of a gust, you're mast will fall down since you're depending on the sail to hold the rig up. If you don't pop the sheet, the boat capsizes on the beach. Either way, there is potential for gear to get broken or people to get injured.

If you want to adjust your rig with the sail hoisted, you're better off loosening all sheets and having someone hang off the trap wires, but even doing it that way is not a great idea. We had someone try to adjust his rig like this during a very windy day at a regatta a couple years ago and damn near laid his rig down on the boats that were parked right next to him (I actually ended up jumping up on his tramp and pushing the mast back up while he was hanging off the trap line on the verge of being pulled over by his rig).

Best to use some common sense and discretion. The rig can easily pull you or the boat over. It's much safer to just drop the mainsail, adjust, and then re-hoist. It really isn't that much extra work.

sm

I never did a thing with the shrouds. Stepped the mast with the boom / winch method I've described. The one thing that made it easier was that I put webbing through the bottom hole of the chain adjuster that's hanging below the furler. I attached this webbing to the boom/ gin pole and when winched down it was more in line so that the side bridles could be pinned. I never had to tighten shrouds. Set for sailing and left there. Longer pins for the side bridles really worked...

We had someone try to adjust his rig like this during a very windy day at a regatta a couple years ago and damn near laid his rig down on the boats that were parked right next to him

I used this method for years on my h18. - i agree it definatly should not be done in heavy air - but on a light air morning, it's no big deal - I also used to do this while my cat was in the water, so if there was a shift the boat would simply turn

we also do this with the bucket... really not a big deal in light air

As I said at the end of my post - use common sense and discretion.

Common sense dictates that pulling pins on your rigging when your have sails up presents serious SNAFU potential. When weighed against the 30 seconds required to drop the main and 30 seconds to re-hoist, adjusting with the sails hoisted doesn't really make a lot of sense.

By the way, if you have thimbles on the ends of your shrouds (not aircraft swage fittings), you can actually install two pins through the thimble and "walk" the rig up or down to safely adjust your shrouds without risk of dumping the rig.

sm

By the way, if you have thimbles on the ends of your shrouds (not aircraft swage fittings), you can actually install two pins through the thimble and "walk" the rig up or down to safely adjust your shrouds without risk of dumping the rig.

Nice - never thought of that. Would have come in handy on Saturday's mast stepping with my friend's Mystere we struggled with in a rainstorm.

YMMV - i never dropped my h18 rig, and did this a few 100 times

If I understand correctly... if you adjust the shrouds for sailing prior to stepping your mast, you can't get your mast up? I'm not experiencing this... so why the need to adjust after mast is up and when sail is up? Why not just set them and leave them there.. pending of course your average wind day. (I realize wind is a factor in setting shrouds.)

so why the need to adjust after mast is up ?

most cats benefit from being rigged tighter than you can possibly do it by hand (with your furler setup)

I use a ring on my furler (called a Portuguese turnbuckle) and i can set my forestay tension (and coincidentally my side shrouds) with the line attached to my forestay,

if your using a winch to tighten your forestay (you mentioned webbing, i don't understand what you mean but you infered you can rig with your winch...)you may be fine, but without a winch ,... you probably are running with your rigging to loose

Nice - never thought of that. Would have come in handy on Saturday's mast stepping with my friend's Mystere we struggled with in a rainstorm.

doesn't your friends mystere have a ring on the furler (a Portuguese turnbuckle)?
if so there is no need to adjust your stay chain plated unless your wish to change the rake (angle) of your mast

He had bought new chain plates and rigging for the season, and we needed to start fresh, as the dimensions were all just a bit different from the old. Still playing with rake a bit. Probably one more test run to get it close to what he likes best.
Actually, we started out poorly by trying to rush it before the rainstorm hit, and if you don't have all the trap lines and rigging clear of everything, it just gets worse. Sometimes we just don't learn and do it several times instead of once, cleanly. Someone said something about teaching old sailors new tricks....

f your using a winch to tighten your forestay (you mentioned webbing, i don't understand what you mean but you infered you can rig with your winch...)you may be fine, but without a winch ,... you probably are running with your rigging to loose

I put a shackle on the last hole (bottom) of the chain adjuster that runs through the furler. Through this shackle is tied webbing that attaches to my boom, gin pole. When I ratchet down the boom to raise the mast the forestay is lined up correctly to attach the side bridles. Before I was tying a rope to the eye that hold the plate. When under tension, this caulked the forestay/furler oddly either to left or right making attaching the side bridles difficult. The rope that went around the furler to the gin pole worked to cant the whole assembly. Tying in from bottom eliminates this: Probably should show a pic as this is a change from the pics I posted raising mast with boom etc. Made slight adjustments.

Second note: My side stays adjusters have 7 holes. The shrouds are held in the center hole leaving 3 on top and 3 on bottom. I've sailed it like this and raised and lowered the mast like this and worked OK. How much tighter does it need to be and if I move it down a hole or 2, will I get the other side down equally. Considering the 1000's of steps to get this boat to the water I'd really like eliminating 2 more steps--tightening shrouds too would be ideal which I've done thus far. Will a hole or 2 lower make this boat any faster or perform better from where it is located now? 15kt wind. Where should it be set for 20 kt wind? H18

Edited by goodsailing on May 20, 2015 - 12:25 PM.

How much tighter does it need to be

i can't answer that... there are tons of variables (shroud and stay length (and amount stretched), tension applied to the forestay when set, etc)

Will a hole or 2 lower make this boat any faster or perform better from where it is located now? 15kt wind. Where should it be set for 20 kt wind? H18

lowering the holes on the chain plate (ceteris paribus) rakes the mast forward
this changes the CE
this will normally power up the boat a little - and the opposate applies, raising the pins will rake the mast further back - typically depowering a bit

All that being said, some h18 racers rig very loosely in heavy air - i never understood this but have seen it in action - not saying it's fast or right, but definitely done by some

It would seem you want a tad aft rake, if you've ever seen windsurfer masts. Well then we'll just leave it centered... hence eliminating the need to unpin, pin two more additional pins, plus foregoing potential lost of mast due to unpinning shroud for adj. while on the trailer.

General rule of thumb on the H18, you just want the rig "snug". It is a heavy mast and you don't want it flopping around or risking it jumping off the step if you capsize. That said, I have run the rig quite loose in the past and never really noticed any perceptible difference. A looser rig basically just allows the mast to rotate to 90 degrees more easily downwind (really only applicable if you're racing). For fun sailing, just keep it snug.

The reason we have to tighten the rig after the mast is stepped is because most people just manually raise the mast. You're not going to be able to connect the forestay/bridles easily if the rig is tensioned. Much easier to just loosen the rig. I just bring one side shroud up to the top hole and leave the other side alone. This provides plenty of looseness for stepping the mast and since one shroud is not adjusted, I know exactly where to put the one that is adjusted - no guess work. 95% of the time we always run in the same holes. If it's really blowing or really light, we may move one shroud up or down a hole (no the shrouds do not need to be exactly even on both sides).

As for rake settings, just aim for a balanced helm, or slight weather helm. Most of the time, you will barely notice any changes to the rig settings. It is just the nature of the H18 - it is a Cadillac, not a Ferrari.

sm

The only concern I had in winching up the mast with gin pole with shrouds set for sailing was over stressing something, that something would break. That never happened, nor did I notice any overstressing on the way up.

I've just acquired a Prindle 19..the EZ step instructions say that you can put a "simple block & tackle between the lift strap ring on the top of the gin pole & the bridle will provide sufficient lifting power."
Is this going to be harmful to the bow tangs or hulls doing this?? 😕